Three Things I've Learned - Round 6 Edition

[LostDoggy]

Re: Three Things I've Learned - Round 6 Edition

The fact is we are a team who is at the stage where playing finals footy is not a realistic outcome in 2014 so the focus should be on developing a team that can challenge in coming years. That means giving some blokes games when perhaps they are not in our best 22 right now.

Sort of sounds like what you said!

Of course I don't think we are tanking, I don't even know if players are being selected for development over merit. But if they are, personally I don't agree with it. Remi what I see as simplisitic is your view that the only way a young player can mature and improve is by being gifted senior selection.

[Bornadog]

Re: Three Things I've Learned - Round 6 Edition

We do have a reserves side that we have full control over.

I can't understand the position many people are taking that "X player has to play so they can develop", it's almost as if that if they don't play seniors they'll be working at the hardware store on Saturday afternoon and it will be a week in their footballing lives lost. Let them learn in the reserves until they're up to AFL, if ever.

What was the point of paying for our own VFL if every kid we rate has to play seniors or they won't learn? We may add well divide them amongst the 4 stand alone VFL clubs and spend the money on GPS units etc.

Well someone has to play in the seniors as half the team haven't played 50 games yet.

The point is, when you have a player with less than 10, or 20 games, I think the criticism should be a bit more lenient, or understanding that they are not exactly going to go out there and thrash their opponent.

[always right]

Re: Three Things I've Learned - Round 6 Edition

Interesting quote from Chris Scott on yesterday's game.

"It's possible we'll be better if we react the right way and do the work and we have a look at the things we need to improve on but we make no apologies for exposing our inexperienced players to the big stage.

One game's not a disaster at all, we'll keep playing the young ones that are deserving of the opportunity and backing them in to do the job."

[soupman]

Re: Three Things I've Learned - Round 6 Edition

I'm with Murphy Contradicts Law, we need to win games first and foremost. A winning culture always beats getting experience into kids.

Not sure where you get the impression we aren't trying our hardest to develop a winning culture.

We have regularly picked players like Boyd, Goodes and Lower last year. There was a debate on here just this week about how Gia playing was at the expense of our kids development, which would suggest the MC is keener on an experienced winning side than a developmental one than we are here.

Almost every player has had to earn their spot in the side. The MC has been willing to keep underperforming players in the side on the odd occasion (Stringer) but we have seen that they have consistently tried to pick the best side possible, and punished players they weren't happy with (Wallis, Williams etc.)

Jongs promotion and selection was earnt off the back of a very solid and encouraging pre-season, and acquitting himself well, if not spectacularly in the AFL. We are hardly gifting games to the kids Melbourne style when some of our most important young guys like Talia and Jones were forced to make their way in via the VFL.

And even if guys like Jong shouldn't be picked, who has done so well to displace him? Honeychurch was the only non-picked contender last week and he is clearly not earmarked for a tagging role. And we have to consider we are developing a winning side, thus all the speculative young guys getting games instead of hacks like Ricky Petterd.

One of the best things about finishing last year so strong was that there was a clear emphasis on developing a side that was winning games ahead of getting draft picks. I fail to see how we have failed to do that this season.

[Ozza]

Re: Three Things I've Learned - Round 6 Edition

Its quite well put by Chris Scott.

A lot of doom and gloom on here. Two winnable games the last two weeks, both disappointing results....but in both games we've been a chance to win them in the last quarter.

If we can go without the quarter or so lapses - our overall improvement will be very clear from a year ago to now. In the backline we are missing Morris' (and probably Roughy's) leadership badly. But the silver lining is that we are finding out a bit about the likes of Easton Wood, Talia & Young - for instance. Whether it be good or bad.

[LostDoggy]

Re: Three Things I've Learned - Round 6 Edition

Not sure where you get the impression we aren't trying our hardest to develop a winning culture.

We have regularly picked players like Boyd, Goodes and Lower last year. There was a debate on here just this week about how Gia playing was at the expense of our kids development, which would suggest the MC is keener on an experienced winning side than a developmental one than we are here.

Almost every player has had to earn their spot in the side. The MC has been willing to keep underperforming players in the side on the odd occasion (Stringer) but we have seen that they have consistently tried to pick the best side possible, and punished players they weren't happy with (Wallis, Williams etc.)

Jongs promotion and selection was earnt off the back of a very solid and encouraging pre-season, and acquitting himself well, if not spectacularly in the AFL. We are hardly gifting games to the kids Melbourne style when some of our most important young guys like Talia and Jones were forced to make their way in via the VFL.

And even if guys like Jong shouldn't be picked, who has done so well to displace him? Honeychurch was the only non-picked contender last week and he is clearly not earmarked for a tagging role. And we have to consider we are developing a winning side, thus all the speculative young guys getting games instead of hacks like Ricky Petterd.

One of the best things about finishing last year so strong was that there was a clear emphasis on developing a side that was winning games ahead of getting draft picks. I fail to see how we have failed to do that this season.

You're right, it was more a philosophical discussion for mine, not an allegation.

The only one for me that I see as glaring is Stringer, I simply don't think he has earnt his spot in the senior side yet he seems to have become an imovable object. If only he showed the same elusiveness and rat-cunning evading tackles as he does with the MC he would be a star!

[LostDoggy]

Re: Three Things I've Learned - Round 6 Edition

Right, so just to get your point across to Stache you then elect to call out others specific opinions, like my own, "rubbish" or "stupid". Good form mate.

Read the whole post. That's my opinion. I am not aiming it at you, I have heard all of those things said numerous times by numerous posters, none of whom were dragged out for posting “garbage”. I also go on to state that I'm possibly wrong, as it's just an opinion, and the statement might in all fact be absolutely spot on the money and I'm just bloody clueless. Just like my statement on our fans that started the shitfight in the first place, it cuts both ways. If I'm posting garbage, I'm not alone.

Didn't Melbourne get fined a significant amount of money for a similar strategy? More fool the poor punter who takes a gamble on his beloved bulldogs with the idiotic view that the MC may put out the 22 players in the 22 positions most likely to win us the game.

So now we're tanking? Jesus…

Bit sombre but a reality is that with an average life expectancy of 81 years over 27,000 members. On average around 7 Bulldog members will pass away this week, I knew one who passed away last week and the final game she saw was what we threw up against Carlton. Did those 7 people miss going out on a winning note because Jake Stringer needs development?

Are you trolling, or are you serious when you accuse Jake Stringer of upsetting 7 old ducks on their death bed?

Perhaps he thought playing on Dangerfield would be more beneficial for Jong than him playing against the Bendigo witches hats.

Spot on.

This place sucks after a loss. You all need some Valium, or a lay, or both.

[Remi Moses]

Re: Three Things I've Learned - Round 6 Edition

Interesting quote from Chris Scott on yesterday's game.

He's exactly right . Young players will make mistakes,but they'll give you 100%.

[Remi Moses]

Re: Three Things I've Learned - Round 6 Edition

Sort of sounds like what you said!

Of course I don't think we are tanking, I don't even know if players are being selected for development over merit. But if they are, personally I don't agree with it. Remi what I see as simplisitic is your view that the only way a young player can mature and improve is by being gifted senior selection.

So Stringer would have been better playing Bendigo on Anzac Day?
I actually think he was alright on Sunday( not the worst)

[LostDoggy]

Re: Three Things I've Learned - Round 6 Edition

Haha, come on Scragger, your quad-quote reply with a twist suggests you're in just as much need of sedation or seduction!

As for the 7 little old ladies, it was deliberate attempt to bolster my argument on how we need to go in with the best possible chance of winning every single week. In retrospect, they may have a little bit more to worry about than Jake the Snake!

[Bornadog]

Re: Three Things I've Learned - Round 6 Edition

He's exactly right . Young players will make mistakes,but they'll give you 100%.

The culture at Geelong for development is fantastic and they have been in finals for the last 7/8 years, yet keep bringing in young players. On the weekend they had 8 players with less than 50 games. Macca is trying to instil the same phillosphy at the dogs. Play the young players along side experienced players, develop them, teach them and let them takeover.

[Remi Moses]

Re: Three Things I've Learned - Round 6 Edition

Who needs Phillip Nitschke ( spelling?) when we've got Jake Stringer.

[LostDoggy]

Re: Three Things I've Learned - Round 6 Edition

So Stringer would have been better playing Bendigo on Anzac Day?
I actually think he was alright on Sunday( not the worst)

No certainly not the worst (how could he be the way Jones played!). I just feel like he's had an armchair ride thus far in his time with us and for mine I can see it in the way he plays, almost like he's entitled to be there rather than grateful for the opportunity and willing to put his soul into it. Some people will come back with the arrogance is good argument and all that jazz but I like people to earn their arrogance. Yeh if he can go back to VFL and be dominant, work his rear off and get back into the side i'd love him to become the player we all know/pray he can be, but continually playing him when his performances don't warrant it doesn't help anybody, himself included I imagine.

That being said, it would've been a tough assignment to pick his replacement with limited options.

[Maddog37]

Re: Three Things I've Learned - Round 6 Edition

See you when the weather turns for the better

I'm not sure you will be able to see me from way up there on your moral high ground.

[F'scary]

Re: Three Things I've Learned - Round 6 Edition

Good thread.

After 6 rounds it is clear to me that we are not that much further advanced than last year. Yes we have had some injuries but the lack of depth is a big worry. A big contributor to this is the way quite a number of our players can't hold form, take the next step up or seem to be taking forever to arrive.

I think there will be a substantial turnover of players at the end of the year. Perhaps the club made a mistake at the end of last year with a pretty minimal turnover.