AFL targets Essendon Royalty

[Go_Dogs]

Re: AFL targets Essendon Royalty

I'm of the view this could go on for 2-3 years if the talk of Essendon opening up the war chest to resource a legal battle. Courts move slowly and although I'm not 100% over all the ins and outs, I'm sure there are various avenues for appeal that will be exhausted until such time as Essendon get the outcome they want - or run out of options trying to get that outcome.

Hard to see any final determination being reached in the short term for mine..... sadly.

[BornInDroopSt'54]

Re: AFL targets Essendon Royalty

Lowering their salary cap would be justifiable and fair compensation to the other clubs. They have disgraced the league and the penalty must reflect that. There can be no whitewash or lack of rigour in their penalties or else the competition is reduced to farce.

Please disregard this post. I didn't realise that we don't know that the substance is illegal.

[Scraggers]

Re: AFL targets Essendon Royalty

No he didn't.

What he said was that one of the substances he was administered through the year MAY have been AOD-9604. That's not a confession and its yet another example of how debate on this is being contaminated.

He signed a consent form to be administered AOD-9604 (which was co-signed by Danks) and believed he was being administered AOD-9604.

This, to me, is an admission.

The fact he thought it to be legal at the time is irrelevant.

[Twodogs]

Re: AFL targets Essendon Royalty

The AFL cannot adjudicate on this matter. They have to bring in an outside person/body to hand down the punishment in order to remove themselves from the perception they are acting as judge, jury and executioner.

[Happy Days]

Re: AFL targets Essendon Royalty

Leigh Matthews says that there isn't enough evidence in the ASADA report to charge the players with anything.

I want to know how he got a copy of the report?

Or even furthermore, how someone who clearly only has looked at the surface facts of a case as dictated to him on a rundown sheet can be paid for comment on the issue?

He's worse than Spike.

[LostDoggy]

Re: AFL targets Essendon Royalty

I'm lost now.
If no players have been charged with anything and it is not yet determined if any substance taken is legal or not, how are they charged with "bringing the game into disrepute" ???

[Mofra]

Re: AFL targets Essendon Royalty

I'm of the view this could go on for 2-3 years if the talk of Essendon opening up the war chest to resource a legal battle. Courts move slowly and although I'm not 100% over all the ins and outs, I'm sure there are various avenues for appeal that will be exhausted until such time as Essendon get the outcome they want - or run out of options trying to get that outcome.

Hard to see any final determination being reached in the short term for mine..... sadly.

Yep - look forward to Essendon playing at 4.40 every Sunday afternoon, playing Collingwood, Richmond & Carlton as away games every year and the odd 5 day break after playing in Perth to spice up their season.

The AFL are holding most of the cards here.

[AndrewP6]

Re: AFL targets Essendon Royalty

I'm lost now.
If no players have been charged with anything and it is not yet determined if any substance taken is legal or not, how are they charged with "bringing the game into disrepute" ???

I think the blame is being laid at the feet of those overseeing the program, not the players themselves. Hence the charges on Hird and Co.

[LostDoggy]

Re: AFL targets Essendon Royalty

I think the blame is being laid at the feet of those overseeing the program, not the players themselves. Hence the charges on Hird and Co.

That's kind of what I'm asking. What exactly is the core of the "program" ?
I always thought it was the administering of a banned substance? If that is the case, how does a disrepute charge come before the actual who did what when charges? Because (hypothetically) if it is found no foul play has occurred, they are innocent and can't have a bringing the game into disrepute charge?
Did I say I was lost? I ment upside down facing backward on the south pole without a compass during a magnetic polar shift.

[Bulldog4life]

Re: AFL targets Essendon Royalty

We have to remember this is the interim report. It is ongoing so no players are safe yet. Their fate might not be known until next year.

[Sedat]

Re: AFL targets Essendon Royalty

I'm lost now.
If no players have been charged with anything and it is not yet determined if any substance taken is legal or not, how are they charged with "bringing the game into disrepute" ???

http://www.news.com.au/breaking-news/the-outcome-bombers-couldnt-avoid/story-e6frfkp9-1226696613483#ixzz2bthg42uw

The ASADA interim report has (presumably) only confirmed what Essendon's own Ziggy report back in March outlined, that they have brought the game into disrepute. This from Ziggy:

"In particular, the rapid diversification into exotic supplements, sharp increase in frequency of injections, the shift to treatment offsite in alternative medical clinics, emergence of unfamiliar suppliers, marginalisation of traditional medical staff, etc. combine to create a disturbing picture of a pharmacologically experimental environment never adequately controlled or challenged or documented within the club or in the period under review."

Their practices and procedures and governance in 2011/12 have brought the game into disrepute. Essendon can try and fight it all they like but their own report confirmed an out of control supplements regime that wasn't adequately controlled. They are stuffed, as are all of Hird, Thompson, Corcoran and Reid. And then ASADA will continue to quietly go about their business of finalising their report and findings, getting Dank to sing like a canary (as they now have the coercive powers to do so) and the players will get smashed sometime in the off-season when the final report concluded.

[Varangian]

Re: AFL targets Essendon Royalty

I'm lost now.
If no players have been charged with anything and it is not yet determined if any substance taken is legal or not, how are they charged with "bringing the game into disrepute" ???

Yes it is strange. If the players have not been charged because there is no evidence of illegal substances being used then why is the Essendon hierarchy potentially being charged for administering them? This appears to be the basis for bringing the game into disrepute.

You cannot be held accountable for bringing the game into disrepute when the administering of banned substances is nothing more than an allegation.

I have two questions that I hope someone more learned can answer;

1. Are Essendon charged with this because Hird took a banned substance?

2. Is not Jobe Watson's admission that he took AOD-9604 an admission of legal culpability under ASADA protocols and if so shouldn't he be the first player issued with an infraction notice?

[The Pie Man]

Re: AFL targets Essendon Royalty

We have to remember this is the interim report. It is ongoing so no players are safe yet. Their fate might not be known until next year.

Yep

Headlines like 'Players likely safe' are almost willingly misunderstanding the situation.

Given (potential) infraction notices would come from ASADA, the charges laid by the AFL are the only ones available to them to prosecute....as flimsy as this catch all 'disrepute' law of theirs seems.

If players aren't charged at some point - especially after Jobe Watson's admission (I mean belief/understanding!) I'll struggle to follow this sport any longer

[LostDoggy]

Re: AFL targets Essendon Royalty

http://www.news.com.au/breaking-news...#ixzz2bthg42uw

The ASADA interim report has (presumably) only confirmed what Essendon's own Ziggy report back in March outlined, that they have brought the game into disrepute. This from Ziggy:

"In particular, the rapid diversification into exotic supplements, sharp increase in frequency of injections, the shift to treatment offsite in alternative medical clinics, emergence of unfamiliar suppliers, marginalisation of traditional medical staff, etc. combine to create a disturbing picture of a pharmacologically experimental environment never adequately controlled or challenged or documented within the club or in the period under review."

Their practices and procedures and governance in 2011/12 have brought the game into disrepute. Essendon can try and fight it all they like but their own report confirmed an out of control supplements regime that wasn't adequately controlled. They are stuffed, as are all of Hird, Thompson, Corcoran and Reid. And then ASADA will continue to quietly go about their business of finalising their report and findings, getting Dank to sing like a canary (as they now have the coercive powers to do so) and the players will get smashed sometime in the off-season when the final report concluded.

I fully understand it looks Suss.
However the above reads (with no other charges being laid yet) that Essendon has been charged with bringing the game into disrepute due to bad bookkeeping.

[Twodogs]

Re: AFL targets Essendon Royalty

I fully understand it looks Suss.
However the above reads (with no other charges being laid yet) that Essendon has been charged with bringing the game into disrepute due to bad bookkeeping.

It's pretty damning from a Governance POV as well as the lack of documentation. I look forward to hearing what the AFL deems as reputable.