2025 List Management Thread

[The Bulldogs Bite]

We're one of only six teams to play in a grand final in the past five grand finals. That's after rebuilding post being one of only three grand final winners of the five years previous out of eight overall participants. One of seven premiership winners in ten years.

Not sure how that's middling or being left behind (though I agree this rebuild is looking a little shakier than I'd like), and while I get the frustration I think much of it comes from forgetting how bloody hard it is to be good with the structural inequities in the competition.

TBB - I agree that we aren't as good as we should be at incrementally improving our list and I don't know if we have enough resourcing scouring the competition, the lower leagues and anywhere else talent might be found to do that.

You're right that they are bloody hard to get into and even harder to win, which is why you need to keep giving yourself a chance. To win finals in only 2/11 years is really poor. Those two out of the box years were great - even if we fumbled 2021 in the final weeks of the H&A season which may have cost us in the end - but why is it we seem to have to keep rebuilding every few years? In any case, the credits for those 2 years should be long gone.

The structural issues with the AFEL I'll give you. It's widening too. I admire St. Kilda for not just accepting it, even if I don't think their strategy works. But they're not accepting of fate, which is more than I can say for us.

My concern isn't so much that we aren't winning cups. I get it, bloody hard to do. My concern is that we keep repeating our mistakes or inactivity and relying on 'improvement within', and getting the same results again and again. The reality is we are a breeding ground for the more successful clubs, so what are we doing to counter it?

If we're gonna fail, can we fail being proactive? Can we fail being innovative? Can we fail being different? We are just so predictable and boring in our pursuit of excellence that I feel like if I went to sleep and woke up in 4 years we'd be having the same conversations we are now because, well, we were having these conversations 2-3 years ago too...

[Grantysghost]

It's a tough one.

The body of work from our list management team over the past 4-5 years has been underwhelming. We've got a generational player (Bont) surrounded by plenty of good pieces, yet we have been nothing more than a middling team.

We lose quality players for various reasons and we target bargain basement recruits.

Without bothering to delve into specifics, in a pure results based business, we either aren't aggressive enough or we just haven't been able to improve the list enough. Either way, it's a fail.

I agree our long term defensive strategy has been awful. Continually short sighted and now we're paying for it. Both in terms of on field strategy and personnel. The last part of 2024 was paper over the cracks - we kept back patting ourselves about being top 2 defensively for a VERY small sample, ignoring the fact it all rested on key pieces on the edge of the cliff in Jones and Duryea.

I don't know much about Regan. His interviews sound OK, but he keeps alluding to not adding magnets for the sake of it. That's fine .... But can we stop pretending our list can't be improved? If it's so good, why haven't we won and played in finals outside of 2/11 years? I just don't buy it. Regan has mentioned we want to add top talent, well there's a problem, we never attract it. So what's the alternative? The draft? No wonder we're being left behind.

In terms of what's the answer, it's whatever we aren't doing. What we've done for a sustained period of time has not worked. We have too much faith in our 15-22 players, we are passive either by a failure to attract talent or a refusal to be more aggressive in this space, and something needs to change.

We trade players at their lowest (Lipinski, Dunkley, Smith, Jamarra) when we had chances to trade all of them at least a year earlier for a better return. We largely ignored areas of concern (small forwards, ruck, small defender - until now, key defenders).

I find it frustrating that the only thing we're good at is treading water.

For the now, I expect us to go after some cheap coverage (i.e. Frost) which we just absolutely have to do. He's at least strong, can run and defend - or could previously anyway.

Rant over!

Great post mate I agree with a lot of it.

To think that a hail Mary in Lobb back there is a lynch pin to the entire defence is frightening.

What was the plan for the last five years? I get Buss, JOD and Cleary . Good start. But really thin and we need a lot more.

I'm with MJP when he says we need better defenders not just better key defenders. Hopefully there's a long term plan in place currently. Not filled with confidence though.

[jeemak]

We're one of only six teams to play in a grand final in the past five grand finals (33% of teams). That's after rebuilding post being one of only three grand final winners of the five years previous out of eight overall participants. One of seven premiership winners in ten years (39% of teams have won one).

Not sure how that's middling or being left behind (though I agree this rebuild is looking a little shakier than I'd like), and while I get the frustration I think much of it comes from forgetting how bloody hard it is to be good with the structural inequities in the competition.

TBB - I agree that we aren't as good as we should be at incrementally improving our list and I don't know if we have enough resourcing scouring the competition, the lower leagues and anywhere else talent might be found to do that.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

I have a similar sentiment. I'm struggling to find a different path than we have traveled though.
Any suggestions?

I feel like our long term defensive strategy is a massive fail.

It's a tough one.

The body of work from our list management team over the past 4-5 years has been underwhelming. We've got a generational player (Bont) surrounded by plenty of good pieces, yet we have been nothing more than a middling team.

We lose quality players for various reasons and we target bargain basement recruits.

Without bothering to delve into specifics, in a pure results based business, we either aren't aggressive enough or we just haven't been able to improve the list enough. Either way, it's a fail.

I agree our long term defensive strategy has been awful. Continually short sighted and now we're paying for it. Both in terms of on field strategy and personnel. The last part of 2024 was paper over the cracks - we kept back patting ourselves about being top 2 defensively for a VERY small sample, ignoring the fact it all rested on key pieces on the edge of the cliff in Jones and Duryea.

I don't know much about Regan. His interviews sound OK, but he keeps alluding to not adding magnets for the sake of it. That's fine .... But can we stop pretending our list can't be improved? If it's so good, why haven't we won and played in finals outside of 2/11 years? I just don't buy it. Regan has mentioned we want to add top talent, well there's a problem, we never attract it. So what's the alternative? The draft? No wonder we're being left behind.

In terms of what's the answer, it's whatever we aren't doing. What we've done for a sustained period of time has not worked. We have too much faith in our 15-22 players, we are passive either by a failure to attract talent or a refusal to be more aggressive in this space, and something needs to change.

We trade players at their lowest (Lipinski, Dunkley, Smith, Jamarra) when we had chances to trade all of them at least a year earlier for a better return. We largely ignored areas of concern (small forwards, ruck, small defender - until now, key defenders).

I find it frustrating that the only thing we're good at is treading water.

For the now, I expect us to go after some cheap coverage (i.e. Frost) which we just absolutely have to do. He's at least strong, can run and defend - or could previously anyway.

Rant over!

[josie]

Smacks of desperation by - supporters

Sanders stays, he is a second year player taken in the top ten and has shown some great ability.

Agree BAD.

Only caveat for me would be if Butters & Port are willing to trade this year for the round 1 pick we’d gain for Sanders plus I presume two other first round selections AND Sanders wants to move to Adelaide. Extremely unlikely on so many fronts. I do hope Sanders extends though and I think Club would have opened those discussions already. I was really impressed by Sanders ability to read the play and be in right spots before his form drop in his last few games. To me it was almost Sidebottom like and he is one of my fave non doggies players.

I would like him to show a bit more tenacity when he doesn’t have the ball , however I think Sanders would be well aware of where he and club seek improvement.

[Bornadog]

Maybe but I really don't want to lose Sanders.
Is Butts any good or has he been inflated due to our desperation?

Smacks of desperation by - supporters

Sanders stays, he is a second year player taken in the top ten and has shown some great ability.

[Grantysghost]

Would you trade a first round pick or a deal involving Sanders to get Butts? I feel as though he's the best we can get but will come at a cost, if we snag pick 22 from the Blues could that Butts a move?

Maybe but I really don't want to lose Sanders.
Is Butts any good or has he been inflated due to our desperation?

[bulldogsthru&thru]

We did throw him to the wolves against the Hawks.
I'm not as harsh on him. He was really good back in 21 / 22.

Which game in 21/22?

[mighty_west]

I have a similar sentiment. I'm struggling to find a different path than we have traveled though.
Any suggestions?

I feel like our long term defensive strategy is a massive fail.

Would you trade a first round pick or a deal involving Sanders to get Butts? I feel as though he's the best we can get but will come at a cost, if we snag pick 22 from the Blues could that Butts a move?

[josie]

Maybe we can try Gardner again but this time it's different.

I do think with Ryan if he could overcome his mental demons he’d be a reasonable defender. Should he play at senior level again I hope he can prove to be a net positive.

[Grantysghost]

Maybe we can try Gardner again but this time it's different.

We did throw him to the wolves against the Hawks.
I'm not as harsh on him. He was really good back in 21 / 22.

[chef]

I have a similar sentiment. I'm struggling to find a different path than we have traveled though.
Any suggestions?

I feel like our long term defensive strategy is a massive fail.

Maybe we can try Gardner again but this time it's different.

[Grantysghost]

If we head into 2026 with only Lobb, Buss and JOD after losing further depth in Jones and Khamis, our list management team should find another job.

I have a similar sentiment. I'm struggling to find a different path than we have traveled though.
Any suggestions?

I feel like our long term defensive strategy is a massive fail.

[Happy Days]

Silvagni was a snow job. We played that well (ie he doesn’t play for us on $900k a year)

[GVGjr]

In hindsight, I wonder if we should have been prepared to pay more for JSOS?

Without looking at the stats, we need players in D50 who can neutralise and/or win ground ball. Budarick should help a little, but JSOS surely would have too.

No point having all this coin and sitting on it every year.

I get there's risk with JSOS but I'd like to understand what we're doing and thinking behind the scenes because the club does a poor job at letting members in.

It's line ball, perhaps in hindsight we could have upped the offer a bit but I suspect the extra year the Saints were offering made it unlikely.