Confirmed Trades, FS, FA, delistings etc for all AFL Clubs 2015

[soupman]

Re: Confirmed Trades, FS, FA, delistings etc for all AFL Clubs 2015

How about a mega trade?

Hrovat and 11 to St Kilda for 5. They use 11 and any player sweeteners for Carlisle. All win there.
Then pick 5 for Aish and D. Gardiner or Treloar and Tomlinson (Add Minson). Both could argue a top 5 pick makes the trade too good to turn down. Collingwood lose out, we've shown we are happy to add another year if it's total dollars the issue.

Talia for 32.
Sounds like Roughy is playing ruck next year with Campbell. Get a rookie depth state leaguer or recycle a Fitzpatrick type.

In: Gun top skilled mid. Good developing Key Defender. Suckling if true. Picks 30 and 32. Pick 50/FS? (6 players in)
Out: Pick 11, Talia, Hrovat and Minson (for his salary space) (Fuller, Ayce, Darley) (6 players out)

Your initial trade is flawed. No way would St.Kilda trade pick 5 for 11 and Hrovat.

We are to generous when assessing Hrovats value. He is a highish draft pick that has shown glimpses but through injury and lack of form has failed to break into a young side that is offering opportunities to his type everywhere. Blake Acres from St.Kilda is in an almost identical position and I guarantee you everyone on here would laugh a trade of pick 11 and Acres for pick 5 out the door. I like your thinking, you've just got the price wrong.

[bulldogtragic]

Re: Confirmed Trades, FS, FA, delistings etc for all AFL Clubs 2015

Your initial trade is flawed. No way would St.Kilda trade pick 5 for 11 and Hrovat.

We are to generous when assessing Hrovats value. He is a highish draft pick that has shown glimpses but through injury and lack of form has failed to break into a young side that is offering opportunities to his type everywhere. Blake Acres from St.Kilda is in an almost identical position and I guarantee you everyone on here would laugh a trade of pick 11 and Acres for pick 5 out the door. I like your thinking, you've just got the price wrong.

Hmmm. I must say I was thinking along the lines of St Kilda management already meeting his manager (intent) and also that Hrovat was contracted (position), so they might need to prize him away and also that our pick 11 is about what JC is worth so we are a suitable draft order position. Assuming more was needed: What then of Hrovat & Minson (if they wanted each other) or Hrovat & Talia (with either pick 44 coming back and/or an upgrade from 30 to 24)?

[boydogs]

Re: Confirmed Trades, FS, FA, delistings etc for all AFL Clubs 2015

I'm with BT, St Kilda are the ones that need to satisfy us in this case, plus they will be happier getting Carlisle & Hrovat with pick 5 than just Carlisle if they can't downgrade the pick they give to Essendon

[soupman]

Re: Confirmed Trades, FS, FA, delistings etc for all AFL Clubs 2015

Them chasing Hrovat doesn't raise us value much if at all. We were chasing Stevens, who was another fairly high pick in and out of the seniors with some injury and form concerns and only we only paid pick 43 for him. And there was a lot if other clubs interested which theoretically raises the price (but in practice doesn't).

Would we have given West Coast our pick 5/6 that year (Stringer/Macrae) for pick 11?

Unfortunately Hrovat is not worth as much as we think he is.

[LostDoggy]

Re: Confirmed Trades, FS, FA, delistings etc for all AFL Clubs 2015

An upgrade from 11 to 5 in the points system grades Hrovat at pick 33-34 (549 points). I'd say that's about right, if anything a little cheap.

[1eyedog]

Re: Confirmed Trades, FS, FA, delistings etc for all AFL Clubs 2015

I'm with BT, St Kilda are the ones that need to satisfy us in this case, plus they will be happier getting Carlisle & Hrovat with pick 5 than just Carlisle if they can't downgrade the pick they give to Essendon

Exactly. If Dodoro plays hard ball with St. Kilda, which he will, perhaps Hrovat and 11 for their pick 5 may just tip the balance. Depends on how much their into Hrovat.

[soupman]

Re: Confirmed Trades, FS, FA, delistings etc for all AFL Clubs 2015

We will have to agree to disagree then.

The points system is flawed anyway, no one is trading pick 5 for 11 and 33.

I would love you guys to be right but unless St.Kilda are in a crazy Vossy mood then I think we are going to have to settle for a late second round pick for Hrovat.

[1eyedog]

Re: Confirmed Trades, FS, FA, delistings etc for all AFL Clubs 2015

Them chasing Hrovat doesn't raise us value much if at all. We were chasing Stevens, who was another fairly high pick in and out of the seniors with some injury and form concerns and only we only paid pick 43 for him. And there was a lot if other clubs interested which theoretically raises the price (but in practice doesn't).

Would we have given West Coast our pick 5/6 that year (Stringer/Macrae) for pick 11?

Unfortunately Hrovat is not worth as much as we think he is.

It's not what we think it's what we want St. Kilda to think. If I was JMac I'd be on the blower to Dodoro asking him if he would take 11 for Carlisle. You then play it out with St. Kilda until they fold. Ultimately it's not Hrovat who tips the balance it's Carlisle, and we bank on St. Kilda's desperation to get him. If Dodoro refuses to buckle on 5, or will accept nothing but a first round selection, then Hrovat and Carlisle for their pick 5 may be their only out to getting Carlisle.

[Greystache]

Re: Confirmed Trades, FS, FA, delistings etc for all AFL Clubs 2015

Them chasing Hrovat doesn't raise us value much if at all. We were chasing Stevens, who was another fairly high pick in and out of the seniors with some injury and form concerns and only we only paid pick 43 for him. And there was a lot if other clubs interested which theoretically raises the price (but in practice doesn't).

Would we have given West Coast our pick 5/6 that year (Stringer/Macrae) for pick 11?

Unfortunately Hrovat is not worth as much as we think he is.

You're not comparing a like for like situation. St Kilda have effectively committed their first round pick to Essendon for Carlise, so either way, from their point of view it's gone. By down trading it for pick 11 and Hrovat they still lose their pick for Carlise but also get a player they have shown interest in already.

They can get Hrovat for free and still get Carlise, or they can get Carlisle and have to give up something else if they still want to try to get Hrovat. It's a no brainer. The only danger would be if another club offers a pick down grade and a better player in a similar deal.

[bulldogtragic]

Re: Confirmed Trades, FS, FA, delistings etc for all AFL Clubs 2015

You're not comparing a like for like situation. St Kilda have effectively committed their first round pick to Essendon for Carlise, so either way, from their point of view it's gone. By down trading it for pick 11 and Hrovat they still lose their pick for Carlise but also get a player they have shown interest in already.

They can get Hrovat for free and still get Carlise, or they can get Carlisle and have to give up something else if they still want to try to get Hrovat. It's a no brainer. The only danger would be if another club offers a pick down grade and a better player in a similar deal.

That's exactly my thinking. We did the same with the Akermanis deal as the Lions demanded second round compo, so we traded down the second round order to get Akermanis still but also Get Doogs Droogs for free just for Rocco Jones. It didn't work for us, but the logic does. The broader argument if it came off we landed pick 5 and traded it for a big trade would be does essentially pick 11 and a former first rounder in Hrovat work in our favour of a Aish & Gardiner or Treloar & Tomlinson type trade with Minson also gone somewhere for his salary space? It's a big stakes play. Still leaves Talia on the table too.

[soupman]

Re: Confirmed Trades, FS, FA, delistings etc for all AFL Clubs 2015

I know the argument that Hrovat is a free bonus in the Carlisle trade but the fact remains we would be getting overs and St.Kilda know that.

At the very least they would be chasing something like pick 11, 30 and Hrovat from us. Pick 5 is a very good pick especially in a draft that has a standout 4 or 5. I'm sure they will try to downgrade pick 5 so they get something "thrown in" with Carlisle, I just think they will be pushing for more.

[1eyedog]

Re: Confirmed Trades, FS, FA, delistings etc for all AFL Clubs 2015

Agreed they'll push but if we are in the game I think we can be far more patient with pick 11 and Hrovat than they can with Carlisle. We'll see I suppose but I'd make them sweat and if they get a better deal elsewhere we keep Hrovat and pick 11.

For all intents and purposes they do rate Hrovat.

[Greystache]

Re: Confirmed Trades, FS, FA, delistings etc for all AFL Clubs 2015

Agreed they'll push but if we are in the game I think we can be far more patient with pick 11 and Hrovat than they can with Carlisle. We'll see I suppose but I'd make them sweat and if they get a better deal elsewhere we keep Hrovat and pick 11.

For all intents and purposes they do rate Hrovat.

Collingwood might come into it with Freeman and pick 9, but I think Collingwood will actually want more than pick 5 for Freeman and pick 9.

[LostDoggy]

Re: Confirmed Trades, FS, FA, delistings etc for all AFL Clubs 2015

Inverting the argument, what can we get from pick 5, compared to 11? Is the difference > Hrovat?

That's a question only our List Managers could really have any clue about. If not, it's a bad deal from our end.

Is pick 5 part of a larger plan or is there a player Dal/JMac love who will be available at 5 but not at 11?

If it is to use the pick at the draft, Dal's had 2 cracks at a top 5 pick and gone for Bont and Stringer, so if he has his heart set on a top 5 pick this year, I'd back him in to wheel and deal to make it happen.

So many questions. So few answers.

[1eyedog]

Re: Confirmed Trades, FS, FA, delistings etc for all AFL Clubs 2015

Maybe, he was a top 10 but he's been injury prone.