Retirements, Trades, Delistings and the Rookie list

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Re: Retirements, Trades, Delistings and the Rookie list

Shaggy has a few years left in him. Bit early to delist Skinner don't you think?

I don't think Skinner is anywhere near AFL level. Shaggy is difficult, but I'm not convinced he wants to go again and I'd rather us cut too soon, rather than too late.
The reality is we need to delist/retire at least 3 as a mandatory league requirement, 4 unless we trade one of our draft picks.

[Ghost Dog]

Re: Retirements, Trades, Delistings and the Rookie list

I don't think Skinner is anywhere near AFL level. Shaggy is difficult, but I'm not convinced he wants to go again and I'd rather us cut too soon, rather than too late.
The reality is we need to delist/retire at least 3 as a mandatory league requirement, 4 unless we trade one of our draft picks.

Ok I get you. I don't totally disagree and want to debate it.
How do we know Shaggy does not want to go around again?
Having given blokes like Mulligan and Hooper all the opportunity in the world, I find it a bit hard listen to calls for Skinner be delisted so soon.
Mulligan and Hooper might have some concerns for their future at the dogs.

[Mantis]

Re: Retirements, Trades, Delistings and the Rookie list

For me at this early stage of the season the retirements are: Gia, Gilbee & Shaggy

Gia signed a 2yr contract at the end of 2011... I doubt he will retire at the end of this year, so if it's forced it's going to cost us.

But he looks cooked.

[Greystache]

Re: Retirements, Trades, Delistings and the Rookie list

Gia signed a 2yr contract at the end of 2011... I doubt he will retire at the end of this year, so if it's forced it's going to cost us.

But he looks cooked.

Most people said at the time giving 2 years to Gia was a mistake, except the usual scapegoat crowd, his season is looking like confirming that.

[GVGjr]

Re: Retirements, Trades, Delistings and the Rookie list

How do we know Shaggy does not want to go around again?
.

I've seen him at the Players Sponsors room mention that because of his fused ankle he's concerned he won't be able to walk without considerable pain when he's 40. The impression he gave was that he would would look strongly at retiring when this contract was up. I respect him as a player and it's a hard decision but I tend to agree that he would have to be convincing to get another deal for 12 months.
With the state of our list and our ladder position it's just that much harder to justify keeping guys like Hargrave on. We don't want to lose 5 or 6 of the experienced guys at the end of next season so we might have to gently push one or two of them this year despite them potentially having another 12 months in them.

[azabob]

Re: Retirements, Trades, Delistings and the Rookie list

Ok I get you. I don't totally disagree and want to debate it.
How do we know Shaggy does not want to go around again?
Having given blokes like Mulligan and Hooper all the opportunity in the world, I find it a bit hard listen to calls for Skinner be delisted so soon.
Mulligan and Hooper might have some concerns for their future at the dogs.

Ghost Dog giving blokes like Mulligan and Hooper all the opportunity in the world is the reason we are in this with our list management.

GVG identified 3 years ago we are not cutting deeper enough with our fringe players like Mulligan, Hooper, Skinner etc and now it is coming back to bite us.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Re: Retirements, Trades, Delistings and the Rookie list

Ok I get you. I don't totally disagree and want to debate it.
How do we know Shaggy does not want to go around again?
Having given blokes like Mulligan and Hooper all the opportunity in the world, I find it a bit hard listen to calls for Skinner be delisted so soon.
Mulligan and Hooper might have some concerns for their future at the dogs.

It ain't easy to list manage, and in a perfect world where we were travelling well, maybe we could afford to persist with Zeph. I'm not trying to be contrary, I am just well aware of the need to make possibly 4 changes at a minimum just to be able to use our first 3 rounds of draft picks. How else do we make the changes necessary to use our current picks unless some difficult and possibly some unfair decisions might need to be made.

Precedent and fairness don't really come into it in these situations, and we cannot manage our list by precedent. That Mulligan and Hooper have remained on our list for this period of time in addition to the decision to activate our pick for Sam Reid this year might highlight why we have list problems at present.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Re: Retirements, Trades, Delistings and the Rookie list

Gia signed a 2yr contract at the end of 2011... I doubt he will retire at the end of this year, so if it's forced it's going to cost us.

But he looks cooked.

Jayzus, no wonder we have list problems.

[GVGjr]

Re: Retirements, Trades, Delistings and the Rookie list

Jayzus, no wonder we have list problems.

The trick is to manage the retirements of Gilbee, Hargrave, Giansiracusa, Murphy and Cross without all of them going in one season. Cooney might also pack his bags earlier than his age might otherwise say he should.

My understanding is that Giansiracusa will be on a smaller contract next year so I'm OK with that. He's still great at training and around the team so while I don't expect a lot from him next year it's not really a problem if Hargrave and Gilbee are in their last year.

[GVGjr]

Re: Retirements, Trades, Delistings and the Rookie list

Ghost Dog giving blokes like Mulligan and Hooper all the opportunity in the world is the reason we are in this with our list management.

GVG identified 3 years ago we are not cutting deeper enough with our fringe players like Mulligan, Hooper, Skinner etc and now it is coming back to bite us.

The problem was that we kept Eagleton, Hahn and Akermanis on for one season too many and missed a lot of development opportunities with younger players.

[FrediKanoute]

Re: Retirements, Trades, Delistings and the Rookie list

The problem was that we kept Eagleton, Hahn and Akermanis on for one season too many and missed a lot of development opportunities with younger players.

Yes we did, in hindsight, but we also played off in another Prelim. Short termism? Yes, but when the coaching staff are judged on the hear and now and not the future that is the strategy you see.

[GVGjr]

Re: Retirements, Trades, Delistings and the Rookie list

Yes we did, in hindsight, but we also played off in another Prelim. Short termism? Yes, but when the coaching staff are judged on the hear and now and not the future that is the strategy you see.

But those players didn't get us there. I get why Eade and the other coaches went down that road but Eagleton for example was probably kept 2 season past his best.

[F'scary]

Re: Retirements, Trades, Delistings and the Rookie list

Yeah, our list management needs to improve dramatically. So, to replenish our stocks, here is the end of season trade/delist list:

#1: Higgins. Trade week. Might be able to get a second round pick but even pick 50 will do. He is a dud.
#2: Gilbee. To the knackery. Should not have got a 2 year contract at the end of 2010. Bad mistake Eade. It’s probably why they sacked you.
#3: Gia. Pay out the contract, please. He’s cooked. He can go onto the long term injury list until then. Give someone a go who has the legs to at least chase an opponent.
#4: Cooney. Trade week. This is like Kelvin Templeton going to Melbourne. The club knew and he knew his knee was completely gone. But there were others who didn’t. He cut the rope to help his team. Cooney must do the same. We could get a high second round draft pick for him from someone like Gold Coast or GWS or whoever.
#5: Williams. Trade week. Injured too often. Completely unreliable as to availability. A draft pick around 30 for him would be very reasonable. Accept even pick 40.
#6: Morris. Trade week. Let’s face it, he’s never going to be the same if he gets back at all. See Cooney above. All we have to do is just get him doing a few laps of the oval at training and generate some press about how well his rehab is progressing. Someone will give us a third round draft pick on the value of the memories.
#7: Hooper. Can’t get a game after 3 years. Delist or better...cunning trade week plan. Get him to grow his hair into exactly the same style as Dahlhaus. Use extensions if necessary. Then carefully select and edit Dahlhaus footage and pass it off in the Hooper promotional pack.
#8: Mulligan. We’ve got too many ruck sized players and he moves like Robbie the Robot. Delist.
#9: Veszpremi. We recruited him as a small goal sneak. Now we’re telling him to run with the opposition’s small goal sneaks. No tank. No guts. Delist.
#10: Murphy. Retirement ("voluntary" if necessary). Sad but we don’t want a champ to have one season too many. Although playing well, the signs are there. This year should be his last to go out on a good note.
#11: Cross. Retirement ("voluntary"). Like Murphy. By the end of the season it will be obvious that the risk is too high for a dramatic falling away next year. Don’t take the chance on another Gia.
#12: Liam Jones. Trade week. His kicking for goal is so bad that he might as well not be on the ground. A second round draft pick will be fine but accept a third if that’s all there is on offer.
#13: Dickson. Seen enough. Will only ever play a few more games. Delist.

[AndrewP6]

Re: Retirements, Trades, Delistings and the Rookie list

Yeah, our list management needs to improve dramatically. So, to replenish our stocks, here is the end of season trade/delist list:

#1: Higgins. Trade week. Might be able to get a second round pick but even pick 50 will do. He is a dud.
#2: Gilbee. To the knackery. Should not have got a 2 year contract at the end of 2010. Bad mistake Eade. It’s probably why they sacked you.
#3: Gia. Pay out the contract, please. He’s cooked. He can go onto the long term injury list until then. Give someone a go who has the legs to at least chase an opponent.
#4: Cooney. Trade week. This is like Kelvin Templeton going to Melbourne. The club knew and he knew his knee was completely gone. But there were others who didn’t. He cut the rope to help his team. Cooney must do the same. We could get a high second round draft pick for him from someone like Gold Coast or GWS or whoever.
#5: Williams. Trade week. Injured too often. Completely unreliable as to availability. A draft pick around 30 for him would be very reasonable. Accept even pick 40.
#6: Morris. Trade week. Let’s face it, he’s never going to be the same if he gets back at all. See Cooney above. All we have to do is just get him doing a few laps of the oval at training and generate some press about how well his rehab is progressing. Someone will give us a third round draft pick on the value of the memories.
#7: Hooper. Can’t get a game after 3 years. Delist or better...cunning trade week plan. Get him to grow his hair into exactly the same style as Dahlhaus. Use extensions if necessary. Then carefully select and edit Dahlhaus footage and pass it off in the Hooper promotional pack.
#8: Mulligan. We’ve got too many ruck sized players and he moves like Robbie the Robot. Delist.
#9: Veszpremi. We recruited him as a small goal sneak. Now we’re telling him to run with the opposition’s small goal sneaks. No tank. No guts. Delist.
#10: Murphy. Retirement ("voluntary" if necessary). Sad but we don’t want a champ to have one season too many. Although playing well, the signs are there. This year should be his last to go out on a good note.
#11: Cross. Retirement ("voluntary"). Like Murphy. By the end of the season it will be obvious that the risk is too high for a dramatic falling away next year. Don’t take the chance on another Gia.
#12: Liam Jones. Trade week. His kicking for goal is so bad that he might as well not be on the ground. A second round draft pick will be fine but accept a third if that’s all there is on offer.
#13: Dickson. Seen enough. Will only ever play a few more games. Delist.

How many (slabs) have you had to drink tonight?

[GVGjr]

Re: Retirements, Trades, Delistings and the Rookie list

You missed Hargrave there F'scary. I can't agree with much of what you have written.