Coronavirus Info & Helpful Direction

[SquirrelGrip]

Re: Coronavirus Info & Helpful Direction

There is an option to ban individual users from this thread and I'll start doing it.

Thank you GVGjr

[anfo27]

Re: Coronavirus Info & Helpful Direction

At some point serious illness becomes the measure, not the number of cases. The vaccine doesn’t completely eliminate it, but in the main prevents hospitalisation and deaths. So it’s a different conversation we’ll need to have as a community; if our vaccination rate ever gets to that 70-80% rate, and serious illness is virtually eliminated, I guess the goal is for a normal life with COVID just another nuisance value virus circulating. I just wish we could begin having thoughtful discussions on that and build consensus on how that could look, and a more inspired approach to how vaccination could transform the options.

I read this morning that in the US there are pop up vaccination clinics at events like the baseball, with giveaways if you sign up. In France they have ads where they show each vaccine administered turning on a light, or a restaurant opening its shutters, or a theatre reopening. They paint a positive picture of a new future that could be opened up by vaccination, and that’s the area where we are so sadly lacking.

It doesn't eliminate the virus at all. Point blank it just doesn't. The AZ vaccine was one of the few that actually had animal trials & we know it didn't stop transmission or infection in the monkeys, so how could it possibly do that in humans?

I really don't share your optimism that the people calling the shots will only count serious illness as a measure for locking down in the future. It just goes against everything they have done thus far.

If the government is trying to convince people to take it, shouldn't that tell you something? If this really was a great product nobody would need convincing.

[jeemak]

Re: Coronavirus Info & Helpful Direction

It doesn't eliminate the virus at all. Point blank it just doesn't. The AZ vaccine was one of the few that actually had animal trials & we know it didn't stop transmission or infection in the monkeys, so how could it possibly do that in humans?

I really don't share your optimism that the people calling the shots will only count serious illness as a measure for locking down in the future. It just goes against everything they have done thus far.

If the government is trying to convince people to take it, shouldn't that tell you something? If this really was a great product nobody would need convincing.

I'm not sure about that.

There's folks out there who think the government has an agenda to keep us locked down, there's folks out there who think vaccinations are harmful to us and make us have a 5G autism. There's other folks who just plain believe someone else will take it and that'll be enough.

It wouldn't matter how good the product was to these folks, and there's more of them out there than just those who are vocal about it.

[The bulldog tragician]

Re: Coronavirus Info & Helpful Direction

It doesn't eliminate the virus at all. Point blank it just doesn't. The AZ vaccine was one of the few that actually had animal trials & we know it didn't stop transmission or infection in the monkeys, so how could it possibly do that in humans?

I really don't share your optimism that the people calling the shots will only count serious illness as a measure for locking down in the future. It just goes against everything they have done thus far.

If the government is trying to convince people to take it, shouldn't that tell you something? If this really was a great product nobody would need convincing.

Perhaps I wasn’t clear in using the term eliminate. The vaccines’ goals are to reduce the number of people who will get COVID in the first place, reduce the severity of their symptoms, and reduce the number of people they infect. There is substantial evidence they do all three, meaning the virus doesn’t rage through the community and hospitals aren’t overwhelmed. That was always the point of lockdowns but why moving to a “live with the virus” situation is different.

As for thinking that if governments are trying to convince us, it’s therefore bad, I’m afraid we can only disagree.

[Ghost Dog]

Re: Coronavirus Info & Helpful Direction

Well, I wouldn't mind be locked down in Australia right now.
Spare a thought for those of us overseas, who really want to get back and can't.
It will be over soon, hang tough guys. And We are a serious chance of finals this year, top four.
If we get there it will be the year of overcoming hurdles.
Great the boys gave us something to cheer about on the TV and Youtube V the Gold coast.
It would suck if Footy were cancelled and thoughts to all those making the wheels turn in AFL right now. Juggling plates.

They will not beat this virus without rapid antigen testing. That's the extra layer other countries are using.
In Foshan where I used to work they had an outbreak last month. They tested in a single day all the people in that in the school district where I used to work, with the results pretty quickly. Can't remember the exact number but it was huge. That level of technology is needed. We have it, yet Australia is dominated by big pathology labs that don't want to give up the golden goose.
Construction work to close in Sydney for two weeks at least. 700 Million a week in lost coin. If they had rapid onsite testing they could just screen the workers each day. AFL house will have to have a long think about protocols for the finals series.

[Bornadog]

Re: Coronavirus Info & Helpful Direction

Well, I wouldn't mind be locked down in Australia right now.
Spare a thought for those of us overseas, who really want to get back and can't.
It will be over soon, hang tough guys. And We are a serious chance of finals this year, top four.
If we get there it will be the year of overcoming hurdles.
Great the boys gave us something to cheer about on the TV and Youtube V the Gold coast.
It would suck if Footy were cancelled and thoughts to all those making the wheels turn in AFL right now. Juggling plates.

They will not beat this virus without rapid antigen testing. That's the extra layer other countries are using.
In Foshan where I used to work they had an outbreak last month. They tested 4000 people in a single day in the school district where I used to work, with the results pretty quickly. That level of technology is needed. We have it, yet Australia is dominated by big pathology labs that don't want to give up the golden goose.
Construction work to close in Sydney for two weeks at least. 700 Million a week in lost coin. If they had rapid onsite testing they could just screen the workers each day. AFL house will have to have a long think about protocols for the finals series.

Yesterday in Melbourne there were 53,000 tests and results are known in about half a day.

[Daughter of the West]

Re: Coronavirus Info & Helpful Direction

Yesterday in Melbourne there were 53,000 tests and results are known in about half a day.

Sydney has blown out massively though, hasn't it? Up to 3 days? It's a good thing that plenty of people are getting tested, but then that puts pressure on the other end.

Turnaround here in Singapore was 24hrs for the test I had yesterday, but it was paired with a rapid test in the first instance. My bloody hayfever has chosen the wrong time to blow up!

[SquirrelGrip]

Re: Coronavirus Info & Helpful Direction

Interesting visualisation of the current spread of cases.

We’re all piling in on the removalists for bringing it down from Sydney, but take a look at M4 in this diagram.

He’s the 60 year old man from the Ariele apartments who went to the footy and directly infected ten people who then returned to their seperate lives across Melbourne and Victoria, taking the virus with them. This is where the “spread” has come from. Cut the lines coming from him and we’re not in lockdown right now.

This man had no symptoms and no alerts, so he’s done nothing wrong. But he’s 60 and he isn’t vaccinated - even though he’s been eligible since May.



Two things:

1. AFL matches bring people from all over the state to a central location for a one off occasion. They are the ideal infection hub. It’s crazy to have crowds until we can reduce transmissibility in the community.

2. If M4 was vaccinated with AZ, he’d have been 80% less likely to have been infected by the removalists in his building* and if he was infected, 40-60% less likely** to pass the virus on when he went to the MCG.

If this guy had been vaccinated or hadn’t gone to the footy, we wouldn’t be in lockdown right now.

Get vaccinated - if not for your own sake, for the sake of everyone you love and care for. This is not an individual responsibility thing. It’s about the collective good.

* https://www.thelancet.com/journals/l...432-3/fulltext

** https://khub.net/documents/135939561...=1619601878136

Data visualisation from @dbRaevn on Twitter.

[Grantysghost]

Re: Coronavirus Info & Helpful Direction

Interesting visualisation of the current spread of cases.

We’re all piling in on the removalists for bringing it down from Sydney, but take a look at M4 in this diagram.

He’s the 60 year old man from the Ariele apartments who went to the footy and directly infected ten people who then returned to their seperate lives across Melbourne and Victoria, taking the virus with them. This is where the “spread” has come from. Cut the lines coming from him and we’re not in lockdown right now.

This man had no symptoms and no alerts, so he’s done nothing wrong. But he’s 60 and he isn’t vaccinated - even though he’s been eligible since May.



Two things:

1. AFL matches bring people from all over the state to a central location for a one off occasion. They are the ideal infection hub. It’s crazy to have crowds until we can reduce transmissibility in the community.

2. If M4 was vaccinated with AZ, he’d have been 80% less likely to have been infected by the removalists in his building* and if he was infected, 40-60% less likely** to pass the virus on when he went to the MCG.

If this guy had been vaccinated or hadn’t gone to the footy, we wouldn’t be in lockdown right now.

Get vaccinated - if not for your own sake, for the sake of everyone you love and care for. This is not an individual responsibility thing. It’s about the collective good.

* https://www.thelancet.com/journals/l...432-3/fulltext

** https://khub.net/documents/135939561...=1619601878136

Data visualisation from @dbRaevn on Twitter.

Brilliant post.

[Bornadog]

Re: Coronavirus Info & Helpful Direction

Interesting visualisation of the current spread of cases.

We’re all piling in on the removalists for bringing it down from Sydney, but take a look at M4 in this diagram.

.

Excellent post.

All still leads back to removalist who were delivering to the apartments.

[Axe Man]

Re: Coronavirus Info & Helpful Direction

I read that M4 is a bulldogs supporter too. I'm glad he chose to go to the Cats v Blues game rather than our game the following day.

Not only was he not vaccinated, only 1 of his 89 and 90 year old parents have had 1 AZ dose.

My rationale for getting the vaccine (I have had my first Michelle Phizer) was not about any personal fear of the virus but about the greater need to get a sufficient number of people vaccinated so we can end these lockdowns. Yes I will personally benefit as a by product of eventually not having further lockdowns, but it isn't just about me. Hopefully enough people think the same way.

[comrade]

Re: Coronavirus Info & Helpful Direction

My rationale for getting the vaccine (I have had my first Michelle Phizer) was not about any personal fear of the virus but about the greater need to get a sufficient number of people vaccinated so we can end these lockdowns. Yes I will personally benefit as a by product of eventually not having further lockdowns, but it isn't just about me. Hopefully enough people think the same way.

Haven't had a jab yet due to eligibility but I'm in that boat too. I'll do it just so we can avoid these sh*thouse lockdowns rather than any fears I have about my health.

[Bornadog]

Re: Coronavirus Info & Helpful Direction

My rationale for getting the vaccine (I have had my first Michelle Phizer) was not about any personal fear of the virus but about the greater need to get a sufficient number of people vaccinated so we can end these lockdowns. Yes I will personally benefit as a by product of eventually not having further lockdowns, but it isn't just about me. Hopefully enough people think the same way.

Spot on Axe Man, that is the unselfish thing to do. I wonder how many people over 60 have not been vaccinated as there is plenty of AZ available.

[Ghost Dog]

Re: Coronavirus Info & Helpful Direction

Yesterday in Melbourne there were 53,000 tests and results are known in about half a day.

Rapid tests give you the results in 10 minutes.
In half a day, someone can drive pretty far. Imagine how many people you can infect in half a day, who can then infect others.
That's precisely why we are in this mess. You can be in quarantine for 2 weeks, test negative, be released and then feel ill, then infect others. The Brisbane airport worker did the right thing, had been vaccinated, but still had it and infected other people.
More testing is needed, every expert agrees.

Rapid testing, It's not a solution by itself, but an extra layer that works. Mining companies, Sydney Opera Companies and others are doing it. I suspect the AFL will too.

PCR on its own is too slow. Testing lines went for kilometers in Sydney, and in Melbourne people were being turned away.
53,000 in a day in a city the size of Melbourne is still not enough, especially in an open society where people do not always follow the rules.
Yesterday they interviewed a bunch of people in Sydney. People in restaurants etc. Not everyone was wearing masks.
There will always be those who refuse health laws.

In China I got the Sinovac one. Wish me luck, I'm not glowing yet....

[comrade]

Re: Coronavirus Info & Helpful Direction

Rapid tests give you the results in 10 minutes.
In half a day, someone can drive pretty far. Imagine how many people you can infect in half a day, who can then infect others.


It's not a solution, but an extra layer that works.

PCR on its own is too slow. Testing lines went for kilometers in Sydney, and in Melbourne people were being turned away.
53,000 in a day in a city the size of Melbourne is still not enough, especially in an open society where people do not always follow the rules.
Yesterday they interviewed a bunch of people in Sydney. People in restaurants etc. Not everyone was wearing masks.
Their will always be those who refuse health laws.

It's a good point. For an advanced country, we're botching the response badly. The vaccine rollout has been a farce, hotel quarantine is a complete sham, testing is slow and cumbersome, our state and federal leaders are engaged in endless rounds of oneupmanship.

And worst of all....now Josh Dunkley can't play the Demons!

We're just lucky we're in the middle of *!*!*!*!ing nowhere.